In this episode, we talk about the “Disability Mindset.” A term that describes a mindset that can develop after an employee becomes ill or injured – taking them out of the workplace – where they begin focusing more on their disability rather than their ability to return to work. Joining us to talk about this topic are two Lincoln Financial Group employees. Saretha Bradley, and Melissa Michuda of Lincoln’s Vocational and Clinical Operations. During this episode we discuss:
Resources: JAN (Job Accommodation Network)
AM-LAOTD-AUD001. 02/24 Z01 LCN-6418725-022224
© 2024 Lincoln National Corporation. All rights reserved.
In this episode, we talk about the “Disability Mindset.” A term that describes a mindset that can develop after an employee becomes ill or injured – taking them out of the workplace – where they begin focusing more on their disability rather than their ability to return to work. Joining us to talk about this topic are two Lincoln Financial Group employees. Saretha Bradley, and Melissa Michuda of Lincoln’s Vocational and Clinical Operations. During this episode we discuss:
Resources: JAN (Job Accommodation Network)
AM-LAOTD-AUD001. 02/24 Z01 LCN-6418725-022224
© 2024 Lincoln National Corporation. All rights reserved.
Hello again listeners, Chris Takesian here marketing manager for leave and disability at Lincoln Financial Group. And today, we're talking about the"disability mindset". For those of you who may be new to this topic, the disability mindset occurs when an employee becomes ill or injured, taking them out of the workplace and begins focusing more on their disability rather than their ability to return to work. Joining me today to shed some light on this topic and ways employers can help employees avoid this mindset are two of my colleagues from Lincoln Financial Group. Siretha Bradley, and Melissa Michuda of Lincoln's vocational and clinical operations department. Thank you both so much for joining me today. It's a pleasure to have you both on thank you. It's fun to be here. Yes, it is. Thank you. So to kick us off while the term disability mindset may not be a clinical term, it certainly can play a factor in someone's mental health when they're trying to return to work after experiencing a disability. Can you talk about what the disability mindset means to you and how you seen its impacts firsthand in your work?
Saretha Bradley:Well, the, um, disability mindset is basically a belief system or a psychological belief system that people have believing that they can adjust to their disability or their disability status. And they become more invested in the disability as opposed to looking at solutions for returning to employment. And yes, I have seen quite a bit of this and our work. We do see this quite often.
Melissa Michuda:Yeah, I agree. I agree. And I had been a vocational counselor in the workers' compensation field for quite a while and I saw it a lot with injured workers who, you know, maybe had very physical jobs and they couldn't go back to, and with some of those people that really, that job really defined their life. But I also think on the other end of the spectrum, there's still a disability mindset with the way maybe like employers or society sees people with disabilities. So I think it's actually a two pronged question if you will.
Saretha Bradley:Right. I agree, Melissa. Um, it's a stigma attached with having a disability and yet more and more people are living with disabilities, um, whether it's a disease, uh, age related impairment or condition. And so you do have, like Melissa said, the issue with both the employer having, um, a belief that the person is not able to really go back to work with accommodations or even obviously the, the employee believing that as well. So it's on both ends of the spectrum.
Chris Takesian:That, yeah, that's that's well said. So if someone is experiencing this type of mindset, are there suggestions on how they may go about counteracting these feelings?
Saretha Bradley:Well, I mean, for the most part, it, it, a lot of it has to do with that person's, um, I believe their self efficacy that they have a belief that they can overcome those barriers, despite the disability or the functional limitations. It is really an innate belief system that a person has that despite, um, whatever the disability that they're to still overcome. And so oftentimes you will look at considering whether this person does have that in the initial conversation with them. And there are a lot of, um, context cues in those conversations, um, things that people will say that kind of gives you a flag, you know, initially that, yeah, they've already settled into this mindset that they can never go to work. And in many we'll just say that I can never go to work. My doctor said I couldn't go back to work.
Chris Takesian:So are there ways that being in voc, you would say, are there suggestions that you would make to say no, like, we think you can do this, or, yeah, I assume you don't want to push too hard, but are there ways that, that you kind of ease that process?
Melissa Michuda:I think that when you're having these conversations with people, especially in the vocational rehab arena, we're looking to kind of shift that mindset and maybe take somebody out of their comfort zone. This might be an opportunity to ask someone, you know, we understand you can't go back to work and that heavy field. However, is there anything else you would have liked to do if you didn't choose this as a, an occupation for yourself? Sometimes it opens up doors just to get them thinking outside of the box, because maybe they have a hobby that there's actually a job that's, you know, maybe related to that and they can perform those duties as opposed to, you know, what they've been used to doing. And if someone truly is still let's say experiencing a limitations while they're still employed, those conversations with the employers should have that same feel. Um, education on the employers part is something that I think is now coming to the forefront, just with everything going on in our world today. I think there is definitely more emphasis on different types of training for like cultural awareness, as well as disability awareness. But I think an employer can really make a difference in that mindset too, because if that individual doesn't feel valued within their employers realm, they may really fall into a deeper disability mindset. If they can see that their employer wants to work with them and have them back and is working with them to make those opportunities happen, sometimes that can shift their way of thinking.
:Right. That's a great point. Communication is the key here, right? For everyone involved, but especially for the employer, with the employee, um, it helps that employee to stay connected and to feel, um, valued with that employer communication and that ongoing, I have to say ongoing employer communication. And so that can help to shift a person's belief system or mindset that, you know, I can never go back to work or maybe even fear of going back. And so yes, communication I have found is, is very central obviously to helping to shift that mindset, that disability mindset.
Melissa Michuda:Absolutely.
Chris Takesian:Yeah. And I'm gonna, I'm going to jump down to one of my questions that I'm seeing here. So, you know, when thinking about that employer, uh, you touched on communication. Are there any other ways that they can help their employees kind of avoid this disability mindset? Is it, you know, is it something that they can implement beforehand or is it just having those conversations kind of keeping an open, honest environment before somebody, uh, kind of experiences a disability, are there other ways that they can develop it and have everybody come together?
Melissa Michuda:I work very closely with employers and providing accommodations, and there are a few things that, you know, just as a provider and in working with employers that I can see as opportunities for them. I mean, certainly there are many laws out there with the Americans with disabilities act and the EEOC, but truly kind of taking each individual as who they are and working with that situation is important. I think employers may be able to upfront just remind their employees of the EAP programs that they have, the employee assistance programs, so that they know that there are resources available. If they should have a hard time. Also just looking at simple accommodations, you know, if somebody needs to, uh, attend a, a therapy appointment or a doctor's appointment because of their illness or they're in like a treatment plan, let's say they're a very easy things to do, like providing a flexible schedule to an employee. I mean, it still lets them remain at work. It lets them remain productive. It's just altering the timeframe that they're at work. And then also an employer, I do feel their culture and the way that they are viewing people with disabilities is important. So training as a whole for managers and supervisors is very important as well as the employees, peers yet.
Chris Takesian:And you, you said something that I really want to touch on it and how everything is, it's almost custom to that person, right? Like every person's situation when they're experiencing a disability, won't be the same. I think a lot of the times someone associates the disability mindset more with a short term disability situation, when really it can span both long and short term situations. Would you agree with that, that, you know, you said it has to be built around that employee, but it can really span both types of disabilities. So everything is unique in that situation.
Saretha Bradley:Yeah. I totally agree. Everything is definitely unique. And that's why having the conversation with the individual on an ongoing basis to see if any things need to be addressed it in terms of a flexible schedule or different kinds of accommodations need to be made, or, you know, if there is some change in the medical status, obviously you're not having a conversation about their medical, but if there are some functional changes, um, whether they have gotten improvements or they have not seen or realize those improvements is really key to have that ongoing communication with the employee. And oftentimes employees are afraid and, you know, the disability mindset has set. And so employers can really be proactive and reach out in an ongoing supportive way, um, to help that employee feel valuable and help them to understand that they are valued to that workforce and that, you know, having that ongoing conversation so that solutions can be realized. Most disability accommodations are very, very inexpensive. And it's really more about having that conversation to come up with some ideas that are a really great fit and very inexpensive. So it's just really not complicated.
Chris Takesian:Yeah. I liked the idea that you brought up of being proactive. I think that's really important to note. Are there any examples that either of you can share of successful return to work plans or accommodations that really exemplified building on someone's strengths too, which you kind of touched on earlier when thinking about building on the strengths, as opposed to thinking of, of the disability as a weakness, are there, are there any examples of building on those strengths that you've seen in your work?
Melissa Michuda:I have a situation that comes to mind and I'll probably speak to it in very general terms, but it was an employee who was having difficulty and, um, they actually had, uh, a flare up if you will, of some mental health symptoms. And they were in a very public job where they had to come into contact with lots of people during the day. And the individual was struggling, however, in looking at their condition and kind of what those triggers were. We were able to discuss with the employer that maybe this position wasn't the best situation for this individual. And one of the possibilities would be to maybe move some of the marginal job duties outside of that individual's realm. Um, the trigger was being around lots of people and due to the situation and the condition, it was something that was probably going to be a longterm issue. And so looking at other options, such as, you know, changing the way the work was done, maybe everything could be done telephonically or via computer and not so much in person or even looking to see if there were other positions that the individual was qualified for. That was maybe more well suited for that individual. And in the end, that is what happened is that they had more of a analytical type position that didn't require as much contact with the public and the individual had the background to match it. So they were able to still retain that good employee. I mean, the performance was never an issue. It wasn't anything like that, but I mean, it, it's definitely a benefit, but as Saretha said, that communication is key and lots of times that employee or that individual who's going through this can actually suggest some great accommodation ideas for themselves that they know might work just because it's something they've done before, or let's say it's someone who, you know, has talked to their physician or their therapist and has agreed like, Ooh, this is a good idea. Maybe let's try this. So really that, that, again, that communication is the key.
Chris Takesian:Yeah. And it, it truly sounds like in that example, and I hope others can learn from that as it is that they're developing something that they already have into a, a real strength that, and, and maybe it's learning a new skill, maybe it's building on something that they they've already experienced. Um, but that, that's a great example. So Melissa and I, and I'm picking on you here. I know you've recently been working on a project, um, around return to work and accommodations for employees with mental health disabilities. Can you talk about some of the work you've done and some of your findings so far?
Melissa Michuda:Sure. Right now, um, I have coupled with one of our, uh, clinical physicians that we do partnership with and, and just shutting more light on accommodations for people with like a mental illness or mental health condition. It's sometimes more concrete for an employer to think about accommodations for physical disabilities, because it's very apparent with mental illness. Again, there's there's lot of stigma out there and people just aren't sure about what happens with an individual and just because it's still one of those topics that's emerging employees are not always going to tell an employer right upfront about, you know, upon hiring that, Oh, by the way, I do have a mental illness and I'm seeking treatment for it. And sometimes that may not even be an issue upon hire. Maybe there's a certain situation that happens in their life. And then all of a sudden it is an onset, right.
Chris Takesian:Especially now given what we're experiencing with COVID and, you know, some, a lot of us merged turning back to the workplace, maybe for the first time, those feelings, might onset for the first time in their entire lives. Um, but, but as you said, it's, and as we've kind of discussed throughout this episode, it's really important to have that open communication with your employer, as well as, um, from the employer back to the employee about customizing, um, and making them feel comfortable, really what I'm hearing, uh, throughout this episode, which, which I, which I really appreciate is it's all about the employee, making them feel comfortable, supported, and accepted w whether they're, you know, returning to work or getting an accommodation for the first time, would you both agree with that?
Saretha Bradley:Oh, most certainly. Um, that is the key, having the conversation coming up with solutions, working with that employee, talking with that employee and seeing what might be a great accommodations to bring that individual back and whatever that might look like and, and implementing that, but continuing to have that conversation, because it's really, um, very effective once those conversations occur and that fear and that disability mindset can kind of dissipate with that individual understanding that employee understanding that they are valued. Um, the employer is looking to have a conversation and to look for solutions, to bring them back to work, as opposed to that, continuing to be out on work. I'm wondering what's going to happen next and being afraid to have a conversation it's just really being very proactive and coming up with some great accommodations that really are effective
Melissa Michuda:And to kind of tie back, I'd failed to finish talking about the project. U m, in that project, what i t really, t he, the goal is to provide employers with that education piece on a little insight as to different types of mental health conditions and accommodations that can be provided for a variety of symptoms that that individual might be experiencing. But the bottom line is that education piece to let them know these are individuals who still are able to perform jobs, they're able to do anything that you and I can do. U m, and I think, again, especially around mental health issues, that it can still be a stigma in the workplace. So I think education and employers changing their culture on d isabilities and in general, u m, is very helpful. So we've done a lot of different types of education pieces for employers, a nd r ight, like I said, in regards to those, t he more physical accommodations, this one just goes into a different vein, but I think it's i s equally as important. Yeah, it's, it's such a poignant topic, um, right now. And, and I truly appreciate the work that you were doing in that field, because I, I do think that bringing those topics to the forefront, um, and educating is, is really the best step in, in seeing some, some change and betterment really for employees across the country. So I think that that is great. One thing that I believe Saretha mentioned earlier was it was coming to my mind when I was doing some research for this episode, were, were warning signs in your line of work. Are there things that you've seen when talking to somebody that, you know, that that's going to be a warning sign, that the disability mindset may be sinking in? Um, and then you kind of have to start thinking how to get away from that mindset, but are there warning signs that you've seen before that that employers could be looking out for?
Saretha Bradley:Um, I'll answer that. Yes. Certainly. When you were having that conversation, that initial conversation with the employee about returning to employment and having a discussion about what their job duties look like and what may be some realistic ideas in terms of accommodations to discuss, you know, oftentimes you'll have someone to indicate, well, you know, I don't ever see myself going back to work and then you have to shift and say, well, you may not be able to do the job the way it was performed previously, but there may be opportunity for you still to do that job or some aspects of that job within the accommodation. So it's a constant reframing of that conversation with that individual to help them to see, to look forward and not continue to be stuck in the disability mindset. And also, um, there are oftentimes when you're trying to reach out to that individual, this a big flag for me, and you've left several messages and you've sent emails and you've sent letters and you're, you know, you're basically spelling out why you're trying to contact them. And this is part of the expectation, you know, you get no responses. And so, you know, that's a big flag for me. And oftentimes it's not because someone is incapacitated or had to go into the hospital setting, they're out and about, you know, they're doing their functions within their day, whether that's shopping or going to doctor's appointments, but that mindset has set in and they've decided, well, I'm not going back to work. I'm getting my benefit. My doctor has said, I can never go back. And so those are all I think, flags that you have to really be aware of and see how to address it coming in a different way at to address those.
Chris Takesian:Right. But you also bring up a good point is that's why, you know, your job exists is to find those creative solutions to get the person back to work. Um, and, and, and where they feel comfortable. So it's all about working together. I know we've mentioned very unique, um, and customized processes for each person. Like, that's exactly what it's all about. It's about making them feel comfortable. So, yeah, I appreciate you touching on that. What about from an office morale perspective? Can the disability mindset, if one of the teammates is experiencing this, can that, can that permeate the office, can that mindset, or, you know, that, that I can't do it. Can that permeate other workers within the office? I know that they're typically out of work, um, obviously when they experience a disability, but have there ever been cases where it's, it's made its way into the office as well?
Melissa Michuda:I think there are certain situations where maybe someone is not yet out on a disability claim, but they're starting to have issues. And that could maybe be noticed and picked up upon at the place of accommodation. I think that the education that an employer provides to its employees on like disability awareness really does make a difference. I think it's very easy for individuals to jump to conclusions about someone based upon their behavior, or maybe they're noticing that something is going on with that individual, but truly we really never know what's going on within other people because we're not down, we're not living it. So I guess I think it could be noticed, but hopefully there are some reminders in place and the employer has a good handle on its training and education to its employees. Just about the cultural differences, as well as differences with disabilities that maybe someone might take a step back and say, Oh, you know what, maybe this person is going through something a bit more than I realized.
Chris Takesian:Yeah. Yeah. I think that that's, that's spot on it's it all goes back to the education, if there's that open communication, as well as broad education about disability and what that may mean. Um, it definitely can solve a lot of, uh, problems that may arise within the office. I think to close. I think the disability mindset is, is certainly something that everybody might not know about, but can definitely impact both the employee themselves as well as the employer. Are there ways that the employer can, can get more informed on this topic? Is it something they can work with beforehand or, you know, some research they can do on their own time? Are there any suggestions you would have there with how to, I know we talked about education, but it is it, is it just being proactive in that regard?
Saretha Bradley:Well, there is a valuable resource is called Ask Jan ASKJAN.org. And that is a federally managed research and administered program without a lot of great resources for employers, as well as employees. And it does address oftentimes, um, you know, the ADAAA and how to have those conversations with your employees or how the employee can even have the conversation with the employer. And it gives great ideas for possible accommodations depending upon the impairment and the functional issues that that individual may be having. And so I think that's a great go to resource or all of us to gain more education and insight and awareness about how different disabilities may present in the workforce and how to have those conversations and come up with some great ideas for possible solutions.
Melissa Michuda:I also think, um, employers sometimes forget to look at their most obvious resources, at least on my perspective is that employers should work with their disability carriers, um, in regards to stay at work and return to work support. I mean, lots of times disability carriers have programs as does Lincoln that offers support for these types of situations. Or if that employer doesn't have a program within their own four walls, you know, maybe their carrier can assist them in setting up a good program for stay at work or return to work.
Chris Takesian:Yeah. Both great answers. And I think that Saretha brings up a good point as well that I should, I, I should put the ask Jan, um, link into the podcast description to make it easier and more accessible. So I will be sure to do that. But with that again, I just want to thank you both so much for joining me today. I think this was an excellent episode with a lot of pertinent information. Um, but I really appreciate both of you taking the time out of your days. Join me.
Melissa Michuda:Thanks so much for having us.
Saretha Bradley:It's been our pleasure. Thank you.
Chris Takesian:To everyone listening. Thank you for joining us. We will continue to cover topics that help employers and their employees through this new environment. So be sure to subscribe to Lincoln absence advisor on Apple, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts.
Disclosure:The information contained in this podcast is for general use and is not a substitute for the advice of an attorney or your human resource professional. Lincoln Financial Group is the marketing name for Lincoln national corporation and its affiliates. Affiliates are separately responsible for their own financial and contractual obligations.